OT: The struggles of McLaren-Honda

  1. dsio

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 22, 2015

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    Hoping we might see something positive this weekend from Fernando & Jensen, the track should play more to the MP4-30's strengths being a very tight high downforce track with low average speed, Honda's chief also say they'll be able to give the drivers the ability to fully utilise the ERS system for the first time this year.

    They're still unlikely to use any engine tokens prior to the summer break, so you wouldn't expect them to use their free new engine in Hungary, which will make it interesting to see what they do decide to use as both of the new engines used in Austria (which the 25 place grid penalties were for) were dead after Austria, and the team were using old engines, in Fernando's case an ex-Australian GP engine without the Canadian GP upgrades in Silverstone.

    So do they use a parts bin special and try to resurrect the crash damaged Austria engine for Alonso or recycle the slower Australia engine again?

    Either way I'd love to see both these guys finish and put on a good show on a track that suits both the drivers and their car.

    http://www.pitpass.com/54303/Hungarian-GP-Preview-McLaren
     
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  2. dsio

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 24, 2015

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    So the two Honda power units used in Hungary have been named by Honda, "GreyHawk" for Fernando, "Erika" for Jensen, have been given uniquely Japanese animatronic engine shaped humanoid faces, and have got their own twitter accounts each, with which they commentate on the race in progress and talk to eachother.

    No, really, here's GreyHawk: https://twitter.com/hondapu14

    and Erika: https://twitter.com/hondapu22

    One would have to assume if Honda is creating twitter accounts for them they're planning on these engines being around for a while and not suddenly dying on their followers (like Ricciardo's Renault just did).
     
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  3. Pell031

    Pell031 Jul 24, 2015

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    wow, that's so very....Honda.

    the engines already have more personality than FOM prefers their drivers to have....
     
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  4. Calibre11

    Calibre11 Editor of Calibre11.com Staff Member Jul 25, 2015

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    Another tough weekend by the looks of things. Red Bull seem to have made progress (hard to tell really, because they're always good in Hungary). Maybe a little progress from Honda...but not enough
     
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  5. dsio

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 26, 2015

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    On the positive side, neither engine went bang, both were electrical gremlins by the sounds of it and both were new gremlins that sound fixable. There were also comments made by some journalists that Alonso's McLaren was the quickest looking and most stable through the most complicated corners, maybe the new engine in Spa with all of the performance upgrades will let that chassis do its thing.

    They might still do well in Hungary starting P15 and P16, they'll finish ahead of the Saubers as well as the Marussias, the two Lotus cars will either crash into eachother, catch fire, or get repossessed by their numerous creditors, and at least one of the Renault powered cars will likely blow so there's maybe a chance of two cars in the points if they drive well.
     
  6. WernerBoeinck

    WernerBoeinck Jul 26, 2015

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    Well, I wish them the very best. But it would be more satisfication to gain points with their own performance than of bad luck and legal problems of other Teams. I think, that's what
    Fernando and Jenson are looking for. Therefore two champions
    have been engaged. I think McLaren can do it.
    They have done it with Honda before. Honda has to do
    something. They have done it before. I'm sure they are able to achieve this, but the question is when. McLaren have not the reputation to stay in the backyard.
    But they have the better watches!
    Sorry for the others.
    Werner Boeinck
     
  7. dsio

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 26, 2015

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    Well I was close! They did beat the Marussias and Saubers easily, there were both Lotus crashes (Pastor in good form) and legal troubles (well 3 penalties for Pastor lol). Didn't expect Danny Ric to take out both the silver arrows though, and do it without incurring a penalty, that takes quite a lot of skill, and one of the Renaults (Sainz) had an engine failure.

    5th for Alonso and both McLaren Honda's in the points :D
     
  8. Pell031

    Pell031 Jul 27, 2015

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    well that certainly was an interesting race! was refreshing to be able to watch Alonso scrap for position for once. even while understanding this isn't some sort of revival yet, I certainly enjoyed it!

    As far as Riccardo, I certainly didn't view his incidents with the silver arrows to be punishable. He was certainly very aggressive with Rosberg, but I think Rosberg erred in choosing to take "his line", ignoring the fact that someone was clearing taking up residence there already
     
  9. dsio

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 29, 2015

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    Was really sad to see what happened with Kimi's car, he did so well, and in the position he's in at Ferrari really needed that podium finish.

    As good as Bottas is, and as Finnish as Bottas is, he's not the cult hero, fan favourite and positive PR figure Kimi is, and for once Seb actually has a teammate he likes, is good friends with, and wants to stay in the team. Would be terrible to see Bottas come into the Ferrari team and have him at his throat like he was with Webber.
     
  10. WernerBoeinck

    WernerBoeinck Jul 30, 2015

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    Hope they will leave the cellar now !!
     
  11. dsio

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 30, 2015

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    Well, there's always Marussia :)
     
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  12. Hubert

    Hubert Jul 30, 2015

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    McLaren/Honda F1: Alonso & Button rumors

    http://www.autoblog.com/2015/07/28/fernando-alonso-tempted-leave-f1-for-le-mans-poll/
    http://www.autoblog.com/2015/07/30/jenson-button-top-gear-report/
     
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  13. dsio

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Jul 30, 2015

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    I think they manufacture a lot of news around this time of year, yea Alonso was interested in other categories but half the grid is at the moment following Hulkenberg's victory at Le Mans this year.

    There's so much conjecture about Button to Williams, Button to Top Gear, Kimi out completely, Bottas to Ferrari, Danny Ric to Ferrari, Hulkenberg to Ferrari, Maldonado out of Lotus for one of the new guys if Renault takes over etc, must be a nightmare being a driver wondering what your future is going to be.
     
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  14. WernerBoeinck

    WernerBoeinck Aug 1, 2015

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    Of course, half of the grid is following
    Hülkenberg's victory at Le Mans, but why not the second half for Fernando next year (also at Le Mans). He only needs a good car, that's what every driver needs.
    I'm convinced, he can arrange the rest.
    Why not with a little help from Jenson?
    ;-)

     
  15. WernerBoeinck

    WernerBoeinck Aug 1, 2015

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    Seems they have speciallised! :-(

     
  16. dsio

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Aug 26, 2015

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    After the Belgian Grand Prix I was looking at the sector times and speed trap numbers, as unfortunate a day as it was with Jensen having ERS issues and Alonso being unable to beat the Saubers, he came third in best sector 2 (the twisty bit between the full throttle sector 2 and high speed turning section of sector 3) only beaten by the two Mercedes. He also managed to pull the 5th fastest lap of the day, admittedly on fresh tyres, but Kvyat, Verstappen and the Saubers were on new tyres also, and in the case of the Saubers had a brand new upgraded Ferrari engine.

    He also had the fastest time across the finish line, which is heavily dependent on how much speed you can carry through the tight bus-stop chicane at the end of sector 3. Its been suggested that the Honda MGU-H is the biggest weak point in the engine, and that the power is actually not that bad and did improve at Spa, but the 2MJ harvest / 4MJ deployment limits on the MGU-K mean Spa exposes the poor MGU-H in the Honda PU much as the 2014 Ferrari was crippled by its MGU-H. The unfortunate part is the 9 tokens Honda started the season with would be inadequate for addressing it, even though Honda has probably got a great many ideas for how to solve the issue.

    Those sector two times in a back-marker car really do prove just what that chassis is capable of, and significantly what Alonso is capable of, keeping in mind this bloke was 8 points (total) away from three additional world championships with Ferrari when they were giving him uncompetitive cars to drive, he nearly managed to take a sick donkey and made it drive like a prancing horse during those years.

    While Monza is likely to further show the MGU-H weakness of the Honda its going to be very interesting A) to see how the Honda PU goes from a reliability standpoint at that quite stressful race, and B) even more interestingly how it handles the Singapore race immediately after it. Marina Bay being full of low speed corners should really show what that McLaren and the Spaniard behind is can do.

    Honda isn't going to let themselves be cripped by that MGU-H twice, and as good as the Chassis is now, Peter Prodromou has only been able to fine tune it, the MP4-31 in 2016 will be his first clean sheet design for McLaren.
    Screen Shot 2015-08-27 at 1.10.18 AM.jpg Screen Shot 2015-08-27 at 1.10.38 AM.jpg Screen Shot 2015-08-27 at 1.11.08 AM.jpg
     
  17. dsio

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Sep 18, 2015

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    Singapore seems to be looking really good, in practice 2 Fernando's P8 only .8 off the lead pace

    [​IMG]

    More significantly, Fernando is only two tenths off Rosberg's Mercedes, and all of that is in Sector 1 where the power comes into play somewhat more, he's quicker than Rosberg and Vettel on Sector 3, on par with Hamilton and Danny Ric.

    [​IMG]

    It looks like he's got enough for McLaren's first Q3 of the year if he can keep that up.
     
  18. Calibre11

    Calibre11 Editor of Calibre11.com Staff Member Sep 19, 2015

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    Agree. Will be interesting to see what Button does next year- I suspect he'll head to Porsche with Webber.
     
  19. dsio

    dsio Ash @ ΩF Staff Member Sep 19, 2015

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    The rumour is that he might be one of the new Top Gear hosts along side that ginger DJ guy and that the BBC has been after him for a while now but we'll see, I guess the two aren't mutually exclusive given the WEC has a shorter calendar than the F1.
     
  20. WernerBoeinck

    WernerBoeinck Sep 19, 2015

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    Think he could join Porsche. They surely can offer him a car to win. Agree. Will be interesting to see what Button does next year- I suspect he might join Porsche with Marc Webber. A Button/ Webber win at LeMans might be a nice result .
    But, as we hear, he wants to stay with McLaren again. Within the current situation he
    might join a sinking ship again.
    What will Alonso do?
    They both are adult. I think they have a deep relationship to McLaren. Hope, there is something in the background with Honda.
    I don't want to see the heritage of Bruce McLaren go downhills.

    I wish them the very best.

    I think they earn it!

    Cheers
    Werner